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Promaster FAQ
The 2005 model bushmaster, also known as the "ProMaster" is in essence a new design.
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fivestring
ICDO Turd
ICDO Turd


Joined: Apr 12, 2005
Posts: 1903
Location: Greenwood, South Carolina

PostPosted: Fri Jul 10, 2009 1:55 pm    Post subject: Promaster FAQ

This will be the main thread to build the Promaster FAQ

Promaster Tech Videos:
Promaster Tech Vids

_________________
Feedback: www.icd-owners.com/htm...pic&t=9546
63VDub is a cool guy 'cause I say so!


Last edited by fivestring on Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
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eeyore
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Joined: Jun 18, 2007
Posts: 1627
Location: Astoria, OR

PostPosted: Thu Dec 09, 2010 4:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Promaster FAQ

Dyemonic was kind enough to give us permission to use his sticky over here. It's basically his Promaster FAQ found over at Pbn with some of the links updated. Thanks to Madpooh, xXIsolatioNXx , manike, Spitlebug, Ben.haK, MecTurtleCocker and anyone else who has contributed to this body of knowledge.



Indian Creek Design Contact Information
Address:
Indian Creek Design
1019 First Street North
Nampa, ID 83687

Phone #:
(208) 468-0446

Hours:
Mon-Fri 8:00am to 5:00pm mountain time.

ICD takes breaks at 9:30am and 2:45pm and lunch from 11:30 to 12:30. If you call within these times you most likely wont get anyone.

Indian Creek Design

“If you need additional support, you may contact ICD directly. Our technical support hours are Monday through Friday, 9:00 a.m. until 4:00 p.m. MT. We generally close at 3:00 p.m. MT on Friday during the summer.
Technical support can also be reached via our e-mail support address:support@icdpaintball.com. However, we do not recommend using e-mail for lengthy technical support questions.”

Online Manuals and Reference Material


ICD Promaster Manual
Promaster Breakdown Schematics
Promaster Board Programming
Lasoya Promaster Board Programming
Promaster Assembly Manual Warning: 100 page pdf!
Valve Assembly Walkthrough
Stock High Pressure Regulator Assembly Walkthrough
Stock Low Pressure Regulator Assembly Walkthrough
Promaster Troubleshooting Guide


*If you have problems opening any PDF files, go to www.adobe.com and download Adobe Reader to have the proper program to open these files


Originally Posted by manike
If you already have the gun READ THE MANUAL FIRST, if not but just want to ask questions read below, then start a NEW thread if your question isn't answered.

Air System

You can use High Pressure (HP) or Low Pressure (LP) tanks with the Promaster. You can also use an adjustable tank, if you do, setting it to work like a low pressure tank at around 400-450psi is a good idea.

Barrels

It takes any and all Autococker(tm) or Cocker(tm) barrels. This is the same as the intimidator, matrix, AKA guns and many others.

Weight

The gun out of the box, with regulator but without barrel weighs 1.997lbs

Size

Similar length as B2K4, but the Promaster is approx 0.765" shorter than the B2K4 because the tray has been removed.

Board

The stock board comes with semi, PSP and NXL modes. You can run it with a 15bps cap, or unlimited (shoots as fast as your loader). The stock board is very good, and does not need to be upgraded immediately. If you want to upgrade it any board for the FS7 Freestyles will work. This is the type of board where it is held in place by screws going through the microswitch.

Modes are adjusted very easily via dip switches on the board:-

Semi unlimited
Semi 15bps capped
PSP (3 pulls then ramping as long as you move your fingers) unlimited
PSP 15bps capped
NXL (3 pulls then hold on the fourth for Full Auto) unlimited
NXL 15bps capped.

Dwell is adjusted by a dip switch and trigger pulls. Read the manual!

The stock Lasoya board has a few more settings including debounce.

For those that need a reference what to set their board to, here are the 'stock' settings for the latest Kila board

Kila board Version 2.4 settings as it came from the factory 12/1/10
Fire Mode: #2 NXL Full Auto
Debounce: 6ms
Dwell: 8ms
Delay: 0ms
Eye Mode: On
Bolt Delay: 15ms
ROF: Unlimited
Ramp Activation Point: 3
Shot Sequence Registration (SSR): 2
Mechanical Bounce: 4
Failed Eye ROF: 10bps
Hopper Delay: Active


High Pressure Inline Regulator

You can swap this out for any inline regulator that you wish. One that works well between 200-300psi is a good idea. Just make sure you don't get the Hyper 3's that are threaded for Dye markers.

Low Pressure Regulator (the one just under the barrel)

You can use LPR's from the Bushmaster guns but the spring guide is a slightly different length. You can use it as is, but it may affect performance slightly. It's recommended to use a spring two or three coils shorter if using a Bushmaster LPR. Or wait for specific LPR's to come out.

Main Poppet Valves

You can use Bushmaster/BKO valves, but some work and seal better than others. If it's not stated to work by the manufacturer then you take your own risk.

Solenoid

It's a Humphries HEA10F5-GL-101W. The same as used by 2k5 Timmies.

Feed Necks

It takes all Bushmaster feednecks. This are similar but NOT exactly the same as impulse and angel feednecks. Some impulse and angel feednecks will fit and work ok, others will strip out and could damage your gun's body. It is recommended to get a proper Promaster/Bushmaster/Bko threaded feedneck. You can use one that is for a Impulse of Angel but at your own (and your gun's risk). The standard neck is sized to use a Halo or a slightly sanded halo. If you want to use other hoppers you may need to use electrical tape to make them fit tight, or get a clamping feedneck (which are readily available).
Spider! has found out that the ICD threads are similar to Automage ULE body threads here in this thread
www.icd-owners.com/htm...mp;t=16018

Triggers

It takes the same triggers as Freestyles. You can swap them out very easily and choose the pivot point, as well as adjust the feel with three different screws.

Ball Detents

It uses the same ball detents as the Freestyle, these are EXCELLENT (in my opinion) and far better to any detents on the previous Bushmaster/BKO series. They work great with force feed loaders.

Grips

You can use pretty much any 45 style wraparound grips. The stock ones are hogue style with a palm swell. Not the prettiest but they are comfortable.

Bolts

You can use any bushmater/BKO bolt. The stock bolt is pretty good though. It is small and light with good flow, not something you need to upgrade/change straight away.

Eyes

The eyes are 3mm breakbeam eyes. They work great with ANY paint. It doesn't matter what color or brand or shell etc.

QEV

The gun already comes with a QEV on the ram to help it cycle faster.

Manual

READ the manual before using the gun, it is a good manual that tells you how to look after the gun and change any settings you need to.

Lube

Dow 33 or Superlube Grease works. Only lube the gun when it needs it.
Quote 63VDub
"you will need to lube the orings on the HPR piston, LPR piston, and the ram orings. all three require a teardown of the component to get to. thankfully, once they are lubed correctly, it's just a periodic thing. Once every 7-8 cases depending on use and abuse."

Summary of Differences between Promaster and previous Bushmaster guns.

-no tray (new noid in grip)
-new milling
-ramping board
-freestyle reg
-pds standard
-lower mass bolt
-QEV
-Updated ram design
-Freestyle trigger set up
-Freestyle detents set up
-3mm Eyes
-Compatible with latest freestyle boards.

The Lasoya Promaster is described as having the following:

Dual gauge block and micro gauges for LPR (Low Pressure Reg) and HPR (High Pressure Reg)
Custom anodized Vigilante HPR (different design than the other ICD markers)
Speed Ramp Teflon bolt with curved top to further reduce paint breakage. Bolt also has ball detent grooves and bolt can be removed without having to entirely pull out the bolt pin
Smooth low profile lightweight body
Dust finish fade anodizing
New style LPR housing and Ram Cap have Quick Clean grooves. The grooves make it much easier to do disassembly by hand, but also wipe clean with a finger tip. When playing X-ball you don't want to spend hours getting paint out of every nook and cranny
Low rise feed neck
New trigger
New board functionality - far more adjustment possibilities including multiple firing modes and adjustable "debounce"
Cut out in the grip frame to allow you to put the battery in without removing the frame side. (need to use metal sleeved brand name batteries like Duracell and Energizer, some rechargeable batteries have a thick plastic casing on the batteries that makes installation and removal tight)

The Standard Promaster is described as:
Low pressure operation: 250-300psi normally adjusted via the gauge on the primary (input) regulator
Threaded low rise vertical feed tube
Quick pull pin for easy field-stripping
On/off indicating LED
Adjustable balls per second
Semi auto firing mode
4-way adjustable trigger
Battery and board in grip for easy access
Wrap around rubber grip panels
Accepts standard .45 grip panels
12 inch ported barrel with autococker/timmy threads
Paintball detection system so you never chop paint
Delrin bolt
Accepts standard duckbills and drop forwards
Low profile
Uses a single 9 volt battery for operation

So, what differentiates the two? Well...

-The Lasoya has a straight rear cut, while the standard model has an Intimidator style cut.

-The Lasoya's board has an adjustable debounce setting, while the standard model does not.

-With the Lasoya, it is easier to remove the battery.

-The Lasoya has a different, lighter bolt, with detent milling.

-The Lasoya comes in dust anodization, while the standard model comes in gloss colors.

-The triggers are different, preference desides which is better.

-The feedneck is the same, just lower profile than the one found on the Standard Promaster.

-The Lasoya has a different operating pressure gauge.

-The Lasoya has an Air America Vigilante regulator, instead of the lame ICD reg found on the standard model.

-The Lasoya has an LPR gauge in addition to the OPR gauge.

-The Lasoya's LPR has a different housing from the standard model.

At the end of the day, the Lasoya is a better marker stock. You can make the choice on which you would rather buy



Comparing the promaster and lasoya PM


What does a Promaster need out of the box?
-ASA(bottomline)
-Macro and 2 90* elboes(*sometimes* included with the promaster)
-N2 tank(preferably HP)
-Drop/rail(unless the ASA is a direct mount)

Is it ok to leave the battery in the gun connected to the prongs at all times?
It is perfectly fine to leave it connected, the battery will not drain or have risk of any damages from leaving it in. It can only lose energy if the gun is turned on with the battery connected.

Where can i buy new internal(poly tubing) hose?
McMaster-Carr has the hose in most any color. Go to www.mcmaster.com and search for part number 5648K23. Specify color when ordering. Price is $0.17/ft., so buy 5 feet for less than $10 with shipping.
Either buy 3/32 or 1/16. 3/32 is more preferred however.


Why can my gun run on very low PSI(100psi for example)?
This is because the way you set your gun, you are able to make it operate at such low pressures and get decent FPS, but you will experience horrible efficiency, consistency, etc... When adjusting the gun, aim for an equally balanced gun, to have good efficiency, consitency, kick, etc... without majorly affecting one or another. Look for the "balancing the regulator" tutorial to help you come close to a well balanced gun.

Is there a need to get an after market bolt for my ProMaster (ex:ACP bolt)?
There is absolutely no need to get a new bolt unless your's is lost, broken, or causes severe blow back. The stock bolt is perfectly fine, it's light and you shouldn't experience any blow back. So as long as your stock bolt is fine, don't upgrade it unless you need a new bolt for reasons of the stock one being defective, but then again, you can always buy the stock bolt at stores online.

Will the LPM vertical ASA fit on the regular Promaster?
Just a simple answer, yes it will.

Noid information:
Humphreys Model HEA10F5-GL-101W Warning: 60 page pdf!
www.zdspb.com/tech/mis...phrey.html

Need more information about servicing your Promaster solenoid?
Try perusing this thread.
www.icd-owners.com/htm...mp;t=15642

My gun isn't shooting at all when I pull the trigger. The marker detects the paintball and I hear the solenoid click, but the gun does not cycle.
Make sure the marker is aired up at correct psi. Verify it isn't leaking from inside the grip frame. Make sure there are no blockages or kinks in the hoses and double check your LPR. If none of this solves the problem it could be that you need to manually cycle the spool in the noid to get it 'unstuck'
Try pressing the little red button on the noid while your marker is gassed up. Warning: Make sure nothing is in the breech! This will cycle the marker.
If you have verified that it is not any other part of the marker then it could be the solenoid that needs some attention. Make sure your grip screws are cut down short and not physically contacting the noid. Below is a link to help you if you need to cut down your grip screws.
www.icd-owners.com/htm...mp;t=15703


Do I need to lube the valve?
No you do not. The valve its self is not moving so therefor no lube is required. Although the valve stem does move, it does not need lube either. However, if you find it difficult to put the valve back in the gun, you can apply a little lube onto the orings to help it slide in better (but pushing it in with a pencil works just fine).

Where can i purchase a rebuild kit?
www.shop.icdproducts.c...all_c2.htm
or
Ebay still has a good selection of parts kits for ICD markers.

How does one get the kink out of the LP house from the noid to ram out(for better airflow there)?
One way is to get a longer piece of LP tubing and make a loop with it and connect it to both barbs(no pic availible that i can find currently).
Another way is to buy a 90* barb and replace it with the one that goes to the ram assembly, then get a longer piece of tubing and make an arch almost with it going to the back of the gun to the 90* barb.
img511.imageshack.us/i...008un5.jpg (pic courtesy of RTisgood).
img148.imageshack.us/i...097zz5.jpg (pic courtesy of JoeJoeBob;different loop style)
Coil back around the QEV style

What are some of the recommended upgrades to get out of the box?
-Valve(Vapor, Zeni, Ebay, etc..)
-HPR(CP, Det., 2-Liter, etc...)
-Feedneck (CCM or AKA - Bushmaster threaded ONLY!)
-ICDU Ram Assembly (although hard to find, this is one of the best upgrades you can buy for the Promaster)




Which hole on the stock HPR/reg does the elbow go into, and which do i block?
It does not matter which hole you put the elboe in for the macroline. You just need to make sure you use one and the other is blocked off.

HP vs LP...Which one do i choose?
Either works. There are advantages and disadvantages of each. For one, HP works on most guns out there today, but it is a little rough on the internals, but that's what the HPR is for, to lower the pressure before it gets into your gun. With LP, although it is lighter on the internals, not many guns prefer LP tanks. So the smart choice would be to go with HP because it still works perfectly fine on the PM, and if you ever decide to get a new gun, chances are HP will work with it as well.

How do you turn the Eyes/PDS off on a LPM?
Simple. Turn the marker off. Hold down the trigger. Turn the marker on. Keep the trigger held down for approximately 5 seconds and the LED will start flashing. You are now in dry fire mode with your current ROF settings enabled. If you would like to dry fire with a limited ROF (10 or 13bps) just repeat the above steps but only hold the trigger down for 2 seconds instead of 5.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xXIsolatioNXx

What are the differences between the Lasoya ProMaster and the regular ProMaster? Which is better?
The Lasoya ProMaster is essentially a normal ProMaster with different milling, anodizing and a few improved parts. The normal ProMaster is available in blue, red, black, and silver gloss where as the Lasoya is available in blue-black dust fade, red-black dust fade, yellow-black dust fade and grey-black dust fade. It also features a new regulator similar to a Vigilante Regulator, a different board with a few more features, and an LPR gauge, and also a new trigger. From a performance standpoint the Lasoya is the better marker, and at the time of writing this article the Lasoya is selling cheaper then the normal ProMaster so I definitely encourage picking one up. All Lasoya and ProMaster parts are interchangeable.

What threads are the feedneck of my ProMaster/Lasoya ProMaster? Are they Smart Parts threads?
The feedneck threads on the ProMaster and Lasoya ProMaster are Bushmaster threads and ONLY bushmaster threads. There are no Smart Parts/ICD threads, because the two are slightly different. Do NOT believe online stores that claim Smart Parts threads are the same because simply put they are not, and you risk stripping your threads, and your warranty is also void using any non-true ICD threads. Recommended feednecks that come in Bushmaster threadings would be the CCM line of feednecks, as well as those produced by AKA.

How do I zero out the regs and tune my ProMaster?
To zero out the regs, remove your air source then proceed to back out both your HPR and LPR. Now when you screw on air your HPR gauge should read 0 (and if you have a Lasoya, your LPR gauge should read 0 as well). Your regs are now zeroed out. Proceed to set your HPR at desired pressure, then turn in LPR until the bolt cocks back fully, and proceed to turn an additional half turn past cocking. Now chrono your marker, adjusting the HPR to achieve desired velocity. **NOTE IT IS HIGHLY RECOMMENDED TO ZERO OUT YOUR REGS BEFORE GASSING UP FOR THE FIRST TIME TO PREVENT BLOWING THE NOID!**

There is a leaking noise coming from my grip frame. What do I do?
First off, don’t panic. The most common problem here is that you have the pressure of your LPR set too high. The ProMaster automatically begins to release air when the LPR is dangerously high, so try turning that down. If the leak persists, check the hosing inside the grip frame, and ensure all hosing is mounted correctly. Inspect for leaks, replacing where necessary. If problem persists please ask for assistance here here or contact ICD directly.

Is there an easier way to change the battery?
If you have a Lasoya ProMaster or a 2k6 and later ProMaster then this problem does not concern you. Older ProMasters required that you remove one side of the clamshell in order to install a battery due to an inconveniently designed grip frame. The only way to fix this problem would be to cut away the piece of metal covering the battery yourself. *NOTE THAT THIS VOIDS YOUR WARRANTY INDEFINETLY!

How do I turn off the eyes on my ProMaster so I can dry fire?
When gun is off, set dipswitches to desired mode. Proceed to hold trigger and turn gun on, waiting until the LED turns from solid to blinking. You may now dry fire your marker.

Why does my ProMaster’s LED blink? Is this normal?
Yes, the LED blinks when the gun is on, don’t panic.

How do I remove the feedneck?
A lot of people ask this rather simple question. The best solution is to get a strap wrench and simply twist it off. Sometimes your feedneck has an adnormal amount of loc-tite on it, in which case I encourage heating up the feedneck (a hair drier works, as well as a lighter) and twisting off with a strap wrench after the loc tite has been heated up. You can always use brute force with a wrench, but you will scratch off the anodizing.
If you don't have a strap wrench but access to a vice try this: Put the marker upside down and clamp down the feedneck in the vice in between two blocks of wood and tighten the vice down. Simply unscrew the marker from the feedneck at this point.

How do I take apart the regs?
Use a strap wrench to twist off the top third, and the bottom third should be easily removed by hand. Then proceed to follow the various reg disassembly/lubing guides in the stickies.
If you don't have a strap wrench, I recommend you use some sort of rubber between your wrench and the regulator so you prevent scratches. I like to use old rubber inner tubes. If you wrap the rubber just right, you sometimes may not even need a wrench.

What does HPR and LPR mean?
HPR stands for High Pressure Regulator, the vertical regulator you grab onto with your front hand. LPR is Low Pressure Regulator, the one located under your barrel.

Is the stock barrel good? What paint should I use in it?
The stock barrel is fine for medium sized paint. I personally enjoy using Xball bronze, but other cheaper paints have been to work nicely as well.

Does dying the bolt effect efficiency/consistency/performance?
I personally have not noticed any difference in performance since dying my bolt. Note that over time the dye does tend to ware away from all the friction, but it doesn't effect or hinder performance

Can I use CO2 on my ProMaster?
Yes, but I highly advise against it, especially unsiphoned CO2. The freezing liquid can really damage the marker’s delicate internals. If you have the proper reg set up though, with an anti-siphoned CO2 tank and anti-siphon, then you will be able to get good performance with CO2. Unless you have the proper setup though, I don’t even suggest screwing on a CO2 tank. I would not recommend CO2 without at least dual PPS Stabilizers, and line filter (AKA makes one), as well as an anti-siphoned CO2 tank (note it is not recommended to purchase a CO2 tank that has the anti siphon rod pre-installed as it may not line up correctly for your ASA, and provide to benefit)

All in all the cost of running a safe CO2 setup is equal to or even surpases the cost of a great quality HPA tank, so unless HPA is simply not an option I highly advise skipping over CO2.

I lost some of the screws for my frame. What do I do?
Buy a replacement set from www.markerkits.com/splashPage.hg
Simple, right?

How fast is a completely stock ProMaster?
On a completely stock ProMaster set into unlimited ramp, you should be able to achieve speeds between 16 and 18 Balls Per Second. This speed can be improved with aftermarket parts.

Are the Empire AA valves good?
When they work, yes. Many people have had problems with them not sitting correctly or causing excessive leaks. Some members reported that using large quantities of lube on the valve orings can help. A poppit valve guide is needed unless you want the sealing face to be chipped an unusable.
Other than that the valve has good performance, and there is also an Air Assist valve in the works by Lucky Paintball, yet it has been (to quote): "put on the backburner along with several other products" and there is still not set or estimated release date.

What is trigger bounce, and how do I get rid of it?
Trigger bounce is when, in semi auto mode, the marker fires more then once per trigger pull. Often times cause by too short or sensitive trigger pull, the marker just begins to “bounce” the trigger when it fires, causing often sporadic and uncontrollable fire. This can be very dangerous, and please ensure your gun is bounce free while playing. Getting an aftermarket board that allows adjustable debounce or increasing the trigger pull/tension are two ways to eliminate bounce. The Lasoya ProMaster, as an additional feature on the board, allows the user to adjust denounce (like after market boards mentioned prior). This is a very handy feature if you are getting excessive bounce. It's best to set debounce as low as you can yet not have any bounce what-so-ever. If your debounce is set too high then it can limit your max firing rate with your marker.

Do all Freestyle boards fit into the ProMaster?
Not quite. All Freestyle Pro, FS7 and FS8 boards are compatible with the Promaster boards, but anything prior to those are not

Do ProMaster’s work well with eggs (aka Evolution 2’s or 3’s)?
If you want to shoot real fast, then generally not too well. Eggs are only semi force feed, which means they are prone to blowback which often results in chopping balls. I highly recommend a true force feed loader (Halo B, Reloader B, Vlocity, Vlocity Jr, Pulse, and Q-loader are all options)

How often should I lube everything?
I recommend lubing your gun every 4-5 cases, or if you haven’t played for a fair amount of time.

Will cocker hosing work as internal hose for my ProMaster?
Yes, but it may be very difficult to get it to fit on the stock barbs. Personally I could not get cocker hosing to work correctly, but other members have reported success, so feel free to try it out if you have some. Note though it is recommended to get the same sized hosing used stock (Lp tubing size 3/32 or 3.32 ID). Link to said tubing located a few questions above

Is this the right gun for me?
That depends. Are you looking for a gun that rips out of the box and is one of the best bangs for the buck out there, but requires more love and care then a standard blowback? The decision is yours, not ours.

What will a new valve do? What will a new ram do?
A new valve will increase efficiency by a lot, often times reduce kick, and make shots more consistent. A new ram will reduce kick a lot and increase CPS.

How long will the battery last?
Not sure on exact time, but generally speaking I change my battery every 10-15 cases

What is the best HPR for a ProMaster?
HPR’s good on one gun will be good on another. Get a quality reg with high recharge rate and you’ll be happy.

What board should I get?
Whatever suits your fancy. Currently the only choices are Kila Drive board, NOX board, and Chaos board. I personally own a Kila Drive board and find it great, but it is dip-switch orientated like the stock board. The NOX board is the most popular choice and is LED flashes/trigger pull operated. The Chaos board, which is certainly underrated for it’s performance, allows trigger/flash programming like NOX as well as fully customizable programming by connecting the board to a PC via Vlink. I recommend checking out this thread, in addition to doing your own research, to find the board that best suits you.

Where can I find a delrin boltpin?
On Ebay, by the same man who sells Ebay valves. You can also make your own.

How can I tell what the LPR is at?
On a regular promaster, it can be difficult. When the adjuster cap is flush with the LPR you are around 0 PSI, and just go from there.

Does it matter what side I put the fittings on the HPR?
No, it’s just personal preference. Be sure to but a Teflon-taped grub screw on the hole you do not use, though(note the screw comes with the marker)

Is it true the ProMaster breaks easily and leaks a lot?
Like any gun there are lemons that are broken out of the box, but so far my ProMaster has been the most reliable marker I’ve owned. If you take your time to learn the marker and how to operate and maintain it correctly, you will get a long and happy life out of it

What is regulator creeping? How can I tell if my reg is creeping? How do I fix it?
Regulator creeping is when the output pressure of your regulator slowly raises past the point where you set it, "creeping" into high numbers that can damage the gun. You can tell when your reg is creeping by keeping a sharp eye on your HPR gauge. If you notice that (with air in the gun) the gauge has gone up over time, then your reg is creeping. To fix, disassemble your regulator and inspect piston orings and the seal to ensure proper fit. Clean where necessary, replace anything that may be damaged, and lube the orings. If your gauge still creeps then you can either contact ICD for further assistance or buy an after market regulator

Is the stock regulator any good?
This is a rather difficult question to answer, as there have been very mixed and conflicting opinions on the stock ProMaster regulator. In my own experience the stock regulator was fantastic. After I had put about 20 cases through it I was getting a consistent velocity fluctuation of +/-3 FPS, often times I would get +/-2 FPS. So I was getting fantastic performance. My only reason for upgrading from the stock were cosmetic and comfort reasons.
Then others have had horrible experiences with them, some creeping uncontrollably and others being horribly inconsistent. you'll really need to test out your regulator for yourself and see how your reg performs. Be sure to break it in before giving final judgment on it!

Is the stock trigger any good?
The stock trigger on the ProMaster is a great stock trigger, providing four adjustment points (pre adjustment, post adjustment, tension, and two different hinge distances from the frame). This is really personal preference though, and I suggest trying the stock trigger before upgrading. The Lasoya promaster comes with a different trigger then the normal ProMaster, but as far as I know it contains the same adjustment points and is only a different feel in design

Why do some people have different colored bolts? Mine is just white!
Some people (including myself) have died their stock bolts using Rit dye (available at a local crafts store). It's a pretty straightfoward process so I won't elaborate here. There are also Alamo City aftermarket bolts available in different colors. (note no increase in performance has been found with aftermarket bolts for the ProMaster, and some have even reported decrease in performance. If you do get an aftermarket bolt I suggest getting an oring-less one)

What is the length of the stock barrel?
12 inches, using autococker threading.

I just blew the LPR gauge on my Lasoya ProMaster! Where do I get a replacement?
Replacement gauges that read from 0-150 psi can be hard to find. The last time I checked, CP sold them on their website.


Originally Posted by Madpooh
Screw Threading Measurements

Barb sizes
Front ASA barb and ram housing bard 10/32

Barrel Threads:
Autococker threads: 15/16” x 20 tpi

LPR Threads:
7/8” x 20 tpi (LPR to body)
3/4” x 32 tpi (LPR adjusting knob)

Ram Shaft Threads:
10-32

Bolt Set Screw Threads:
5/16 -24 x 1/2"

Clamshell to Body Screws (4 ea.) :
6-32 x 3/8" (Socket Head Cap)

Grip Panel to Clamshell(4 ea.):
6-32 x 1/4" (button head)

Trigger Set Screws (3 ea.) :
8-32 x 1/4" (set Screw)
8-32 x 1/2" (set Screw)

Valve Lock Screw (1 ea.):
3/8-24 x 1/4"

Solenoid to Clamshell Screw (2 ea.):
1-72x1/2 (Socket Head Cap)

Eye Cover Screw (2 ea.):
6-32 x 5/8” (button Head)

On/off Switch Screw (2 ea.):
3-48 x 3/16”

Board to Clamshell Screw (2 ea.):
1-72x3/8 (Socket Head Cap)


Bottomline Screw (2 ea.):
10-32 (lengths vary)

HPR Set Screw:
5/16 x 1/2 (set screw)
Feedneck Threads
0.812"-32 threaded

Feedneck measurements:
www.hunt101.com/data/5...008-01.gif (small), www.hunt101.com/data/5...008-01.gif (big), or www3.telus.net/public/...andard.zip (pdf file)
*Information thanks to SpitleBug
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madpooh
O-ring Sizes (Dash No.)

LPR:
Lpr adjsuter: 016
Piston: 015
Body: 019 and 016

Valve:
016 (2)

Ram:
Housing: 015 and 010
Shaft: 010

Asa:
010 and 006

HPR:
Upper part: 015 and 010
Piston: 015
Middle part: 020

Common Upgrade List
Out of the box people will usually upgrade the marker in the order shown, from most important to the least important.

ASA
Feedneck
High Pressure Regulator
Barrel
Valve
Trigger

Barrels
Any autococker threaded barrel will work. A discussion of potential barrels you should use would be too long for this sticky. Try and get a barrel kit that has a good amount differing bore sizes and you should be okay. Personal preference will dictate which is best.

Feednecks

AKA Feedneck – Great quality feedneck, the kind we’ve come to expect from AKA. Be sure to choose the third one down in Bushmaster threads. It’s height is somewhere between CCM’s no pro and no-rise, which is the perfect height in my opinion. It has a nice clean look, and which isn’t as fancy as the CCM, is cheaper, and just as functional.
www.akalmp.com/feedtubes.html

CCM No-Pro/ No-Rise – The only other true ‘Bushmaster’ threaded feedneck out there. This is the nicer looking, however more expensive option. Either way, both the AKA and the CCM are quality products.
stores.ebay.com/ccmfactorydirect
www.compulsivepaintbal...Rise-Black

ASAs
Note: There are many ASA’s currently on the market so don’t be limited by these choices. Make sure the ASA you choose is a solid piece of equipment. You don’t want your bottle coming off your marker in the middle of a game because of poor design.
Try to get a rail with least two points of contact between the rail and the ASA. Also, to keep things a little bit safer, get an ASA with a bleed mechanism.

Custom Products ASA/Rail combo- Excellent ASA. Well-balanced, easy to turn, looks decent, and you can get it in a plethora of different colors. What more could you ask for?
www.compulsivepaintbal...Drop-Black
www.compulsivepaintbal...line-Black

AKA ASA/Rail combo – Simple and effective.
www.akalmp.com/misc.html

Planet Eclipse OOPS (On/Off Purge System) – Looks sharp, easy to turn and has a bleed function as well.
www.compulsivepaintbal...Rail-Black

There are other options, but I feel these 3 are the most common/ best available for the price.


High Pressure Regulators

Evil Detonator – Simply put, it’s the best bang for your buck. At 25 dollars, it’s one of the best regs out there. Disassembly isn’t the easiest, but again, TWENTY-FIVE DOLLARS. Think about it.

AKA 2-Litre + Dual - Arguably the best reg out there. Period. More expensive than the Detonator, (obviously), however if you want the best performance possible, this 2-Litre is the way to go.

AKA Sidewinder - Little brother of the 2-Litre. Still an excellent reg, at a slightly more reasonable price.

Mac Dev Gladiator - Very consistent regulator. May want to buy directly from Mac Dev with a combination of the Glad, Red valve and the Sonic LPRto save on the expensive shipping. (If you by direct from them, it’ll be coming from Aussi-land.(Australia))

CP Regulator – Good reg, fair price. Some users have had reportedly had problems with this reg, however I have had only good experiences with it. Your call, it’s hit or miss.

Valves
Note: All valves that fit Bushmasters and BKO’s (w/ the exception of the Venom) will also work with Promasters.

MacDev Red valve – Excellent valve. If you can find one in the B/S/T. I strongly recommend grabbing it.

Ebay valve - Had some problems early on with leaking, however that seems to have been fixed by the manufacturer. If it works, it’s an excellent buy for the price.

Vapor valve – Great valve, however has been discontinued due to problems with a newer batch of cupseals. If you can find one in the B/S/T, pick it up.

Zenitram valve- Excellent valve. If you can find one in the B/S/T. I strongly recommend grabbing it.

AKA Tornado, Empire AA Balanced, and Rocketman valves – Regular users have found that these valves are not easily adjusted/compatible with the Bushmaster/BKO/Promaster platforms. These may work okay, but may require more attention than the others listed above.

Low Pressure Regulators
Note: You can use LPR's from the Bushmaster guns but the spring guide is a slightly different length. You can use it as is, but it may affect performance slightly. It's recommended to use a spring two or three coils shorter if using a Bushmaster LPR.

AKA SCM III - Fantastic LPR. Will improve consistency, and at a great price.
akalmp.com/regulators.html

Mac Dev Sonic LPR – Another excellent LPR. Out of production so you’ll have to buy used. Some users report problems with the threading not being compatible with the Promaster. Usually this problem is solved with a threadfile.

Micro Rock - *Description from DyeMonic “Well, it's the best damn LPR available. 'Nuff said.” **However, you WILL need to buy an adapter to make this work with your Promaster. I simply don't believe this is the best option available because of the extra $50 is will cost you to use it.**

Boards

NOX – Great board, great programming. Uses trigger pulls to change modes and settings. Hard to find these days. The Promaster uses ONLY the vertically mounted NOX boards, not the older, horizontally mounted ones.

Kila Drive – Another great board at a good price. Still can be gotten new and has updated PSP modes. Instead of trigger pulls for programming, it uses dipswitches. Bonus: the manufacturer advertises free software upgrades for life.
www.kilaproducts.com/p...amp;pid=16

Chaos 2k7 – Another hard to find option for an aftermarket board. The Chaos’ nice feature is the optional V-Link (for an additional $20), which allows you to connect the board to your PC, and program modes on there.

Triggers

ICD Aftermarket Triggers – ICD offers a few different triggers for those who might be interested in a different feel.
www.shop.icdproducts.c...all_c2.htm

Custom Products Sling Trigger – Very smooth movement, comfortable design. Uses dual roller bearings, giving you one of the fastest and smoothest pulls available. store.customproducts.u...egoryID=31
www.compulsivepaintbal...gger-Black

New Era Designs Trigger – Made out of a hybrid carbon fiber material, it is one of the lightest, smoothest, and sexiest triggers out for the Promaster. These are hard to find and command good prices.

Vapor Works S4 - Another dual roller bearing trigger, this is just another option for you to choose from. Made in the scythe design, it is very comfortable to use, in my opinion.

Ram Assemblies

ICDU Low Pressure Cylinder – Simply put, this is the upgrade to put into your Promaster. It reduces kick by a ton, makes it shoot smooth as butter, etc etc. If you want a sexy shooting Promaster, buy this. Hard to come by these days so you might want to act fast if you see one in the B/S/T.

Crammer - The crammer is a replica of the ICDU ram assembly and has the same operating attributes (less kick, shoot as smooth as butter etc… ). Some users have reported this assembly being problematic due to requiring irregular o-ring sizes, however there are plenty of Crammers that work just fine. User Hansolo8221 has a good handle on how to address these issues by using metric o-rings, Dow 55 and a bumper on the back cap. If you are interested in one, Hansolo8221 is still around and can probably help you out here.
www.icd-owners.com/htm...ht=Crammer

Volumizers

ICD sold the the ICDU Low Pressure Cylinder often as a package with an enlarged LPR that was supposed to provide more available air and help increase ROF. Not many people opted for this upgrade and these can be fairly rare items. The jury is still out on whether or not it is a worthwhile upgrade.

Rams

Alamo City Hybrid Stainless Steel Delrin Ram – This aftermarket ram is 10g lighter than the stock ram and is advertised to offering increased CPS and reduced kick. www.alamocitypb.com/MA...S/icd.html
Some discussion about whether this is a worthwhile upgrade is here
www.icd-owners.com/htm...mp;start=0

Eye Covers/Detents
Kila Products Magnetic Detents$40(These are also new eye covers, lower profile)
www.kilaproducts.com/p...amp;pid=34


Bolts
I do no recommend buying a new bolt. The stock is as close to perfect as you can get, and you can always mod it yourself if you feel up to it. You can cut detent slots, mill o-ring grooves, and cut the end to match the milling of the gun, or dye the bolt using Rit Dye. Upgrading this is simply a waste of 20-30 dollars and will give you little to no performance increase. This is simply my opinion though, so buy one if you wish.

Shocktech Superfly Bolt – Aluminum reinforced stock bolt. Comes in many different colors.

ACP Low Blow Bolt - Stock bolt with o-rings and cool colors.

eBay Spike Pullpin (in black and white. – This is not a necessary upgrade, far from it. But it looks cool, is much lighter than the stock pin, and durable. Some people have reported having it snap after 5000 shots or so, but I believe that was just a problem with the early batches. I have shot over 15 - 25 cases with this and it’s still working fine.

Gauges
Any standard 3/8th NPT gauge will work.

ASP Gauge – If you want more accurate pressure readings, this is your best option. Only 8 dollars, 0-300 PSI, and looks nice and clean. Performs the same as the 15-20 dollar MacDev, Bob Long, and PE ones.
www.airsoldier.com/mm5...ode=GAUGES

Grips
Any .45 styled grips will work. They are all personal preference and just for looks, hence do not get their own section.

Exterior LED
Any standard 5mm LED from radioshack will work, leds are used for looks only, such as super bright LEDs and multiple ones at different locations.

Vertical ASA
There are no actual upgradable Verticle ASAs for the ProMaster, but some can be modded. ONLY BKO ASAs WILL BE ABLE TO FIT AS AN UPGRADE!Here is the list of ASAs that can be modded to fit for an upgrade(excluding stock BKO ASAs:
Zenitram 15* BKO ASA
Zenitram BKO ASA w/ autococker lpr hole
Zenitram 15* BKO ASA w/ autococker lpr hole
*Zenitram is no longer in production so these need to be bought used($30-$45)

Solenoid
Humphrey CRCB-0053W $60
If you really want the fastest Promaster out there, you will probably want to upgrade the 'noid with this one. Can handle higher pressures and has an overall faster cycle speed. Might as well pick this one up if you are thinking about buying a new replacement anyway since airsoldier always seems to have them in stock. (Unlike the HEA10F5)
www.airsoldier.com/mm5...=SOLENOIDS



Promaster Animation


Eeyore's take on some Promaster issues:


Bolts and Pins
The stock Lasoya PM bolt I got had a BB that got pushed out of it's home after I tensioned too much on the back screw. Everytime I pulled out the pin all the way the BB would fall out. Not good; I didn't like it falling into the ram chamber there where it could seriously cause some damage if I wasn't careful. I got the Shocktech bolt and that problem was solved. The only thing I would have asked the Shocktech bolt to have was bigger detent slots and that small cutout on the top that the stock bolt had to help paint drop into the breech faster.
The pins are shown below too. I think the Lasoya pin is the best only because it has an added divot in it to lock the pin in when you pull it up to remove the bolt.


Valves

I reinstalled my eBay valve once and mistakenly pushed it into the body without the piston in it with a screwdriver. Huge mistake. Leaked like a seive afterwards. I don't recommend you do that. Here's a couple of photos for your reference. Below is shown the area you need to be careful with. If you have a leaky valve, see the fix detailed a few photos down.


Here's stock and eBay valves for comparison




I hear a leak down my barrel, how do I fix this?
How do I fix a valve leak?
Most likely, the culprit is a bad valve cup seal. This could be because the seal on the valve piston is dirty and/or damaged or the cup seal on the valve body is dirty and/or damaged. You can replace the seal on the piston with one that comes in your parts box, but it is quite a hassle getting the piston apart. For a stock valve this is an option, but not always an easy one. For many aftermarket valves, there is nothing you can do to the piston to fix the leak, you'll have to service the valve body.
Sometimes, I find a slight leak down the barrel right after I gas my marker up after sitting for a while. This can be solved by dry firing the marker 50-100 times or so. If this doesn't stop the leak, turn off the air to the marker but do not bleed the line. Watch the HPR gauge. If you lose 100 psi or more in the course of a minute or two, you might want to address this leak (given that you know that it's not coming from somewhere else). If your marker stays pressurized and loses 100psi or less over the course of, say, 5 or more minutes, then I wouldn't be too concerned.
Often, I find that a valve leak is due to a slight amount of damage done during maintenance of the valve and/or LPR. The piston and any other metal objects that contact the valve body cup seal can do damage you won't be able to see right away. Priority number one in curing valve leaks is preventing them. Don't take your valve or valve piston out un-necessarily. When you do take your valve out, make sure you inspect it and sometimes you will see small nicks or burrs right on the cup. These will cause leaks. If you can see them then you should do something about it.
If you know you have a valve leak and have traced it to the cup seal area, you can mitigate the damage done by lightly sanding/polishing the afflicted area with some high grit sandpaper.
(This process is thanks to DonF)
Get your hands on some 1800-2000 grit sandpaper. This can be found at many auto parts stores. Take your sandpaper and lay it on a piece of glass or other very smooth, flat surface. Wet the cup side portion of your valve and press it onto the sandpaper. Now rotate the valve in one direction while you turn the valve around the sandpaper. Do this a couple times in full revolutions, always turning the valve in the same directions. Look at the progress you've made so far; see if you notice any nicks or burrs becoming less apparent. You don't want to over do this process or you will cause more damage than you will fix. But when the process is done you should have a better seal on your valve and hopefully fix the leak.
Here, shown below, is a diagram showing how you go about sanding/polishing your valve cup seal.


Boards
A few photos of boards and distinguishing characteristics for reference are shown below. If you need a tourney legal board these days, your only option is the Kila board. If you are just looking to upgrade your board for recreational purposes, I'd lean towards the NoX board just because you don't have to remove the grip to change board settings.
Late model stock Freestyle boards may be used, but the dwell settings may be a little higher than needed, so efficiency may suffer.





Weights:
(all measurements +/- 0.2g)

Bolts and Pins:
Stock Lasoya bolt (w/just bb, spring + screw) = 21.9g
New style Shocktech bolt = 21.6g
Old style Shocktech bolt = 22.4g

Stock Lasoya link pin = 10.0g
Shocktech link pin = 9.1g
Delrin spike pin = 2.1g

Ram Assembly analysis:

Stock Ram, QEV w hose and 90deg barb = 88.8g
Stock ram back cap, spring and spring guide = 8.7g
Estimated stock piston and hammer weight = 50.3g*
^ got this by subtracting the ICDU LPC housing weight and back cap from the total on top.
* I did not feel like removing the hammer/piston at the time of weighing. Red loctite is a beetch.

ICDU Low Pressure Cylinder assembly, QEV w hose and 90deg barb = 79.2g
ICDU LPC backcap = 10.5g
ICDU LPC Piston = 38.9g
ICDU LPC housing (everything listed above except the piston and backcap) = 29.8g

Estimated total reciprocating mass of two ram assemblies
(not counting valve piston effects, regulator effects, or paintball effects)

Stock Lasoya ram, bolt and link pin = 82.2g
^(=50.3+21.9+10.0)

ICDU LPC, new Shocktech bolt and delrin link pin = 62.6g
^(=38.9+21.6+2.1)

Estimated percent reduction in reciprocating mass between stock components and a ICDU LPC with Shocktech bolt + delrin pin = 23.5


=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=


Disassembly Pictures and Walkthrough

A Lasoya Promaster in a state of total assembly.


Take off/out HPR, ASA and bolt. Remove the 4 grip panel screws (6/32x1/4) holding on your grips. Remove grips and set aside these small parts somewhere you won't lose them.


Loosen bolts attaching your rail or ASA (you don't have to take it off completely if you don't want to). Remove the 2 ram mounting screws (10/32x1/2) at the back of the body. Flip the marker to expose the right side. Remove the 4 screws (6/32x1/4) holding together the grip frame and the 2 screws (6/32x3/8) mounting the right side grip frame to the body.


This will enable you to remove the right hand side of the grip frame. When you do this be careful you do not lose your trigger spring and pin when you part the grip sections. At this point I usually remove the battery and disconnect both the solenoid and board from the harness. Remove the screws (6/32x5/8 buttonheads) to both eye covers. Set aside associated parts somewhere you won't lose these small pieces.


Now finish removing the eye covers if you haven't already and go ahead and remove the other two screws (6/32x3/8) holding the left grip frame onto the body.


The frame will be loose now, so be careful you don't damage any part of the eye wiring or hoses. Remove the 4/40x1/2 phillips or SHCS bolts that hold the solenoid to the frame. Put them somewhere you won't lose them. Pull away left hand side of grip frame.


At this point I'd start removing hoses from the barbs at the solenoid. I keep most hoses attached to barb ends on the marker body. Be very careful since these hoses tend to need a lot of force to remove them. I usually clear off anything on the table I'm working on since I have a tendency to knock things around pulling off these hoses. I wouldn't recommend you use a pair of pliers to grip and pull the hoses off since they can damage the hoses, but I've used them a few times when I just couldn't get a good enough grip.


Hoses have been removed from the solenoid and the ICDU Low Pressure Cylinder has been removed from the marker.


Pic of the stock LPR and the stock valve spring taken out.


To access the valve, you need to remove this screw (3/8-24x1/4 set). This part most likely will have loctite on it. You may need to heat the screw to aide in easy removal.


Remove the set screw for access to the valve.


Push the valve out with something made of wood or plastic preferably. I'm using a drumstick in the picture.


Here's my eBay valve. I smeared a little Dow 55 on the valve o-rings just to ensure I wouldn't have any leaks. An admittedly poor job of applying the lube in the picture, but I didn't want to get my camera smeared with the stuff.


When you push the valve back in the marker, be sure to have the main opening facing vertically. Put the stem in the valve and use a wooden or plastic dowel to push it the rest of the way in.


Ensure the valve is facing the right way and move it into position as needed through the hole. Put the set screw back in and I'd recommend applying some blue threadlock or teflon tape to secure it properly. Do not overtighten the set screw. This could possibly damage the valve by warping it.


Last edited by eeyore on Sat Feb 11, 2012 4:52 pm; edited 36 times in total
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maloneoni
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 09, 2010 8:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Promaster FAQ

holy crap! good work on this, i am gonna have to take some time to read through it.

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I see potential for a CO2 operated tattoo gun...

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63VDub
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 09, 2010 8:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Promaster FAQ

Very nice, indeed. Only things I have found are in the original description, it says the Pm is such abd such inches less tall than the Bushmaster. Can we change that to "shorter" and dementedproducts.us is no longer available.

Other than that, great stuff. Let me know when you are comfortable with it, and we'll move it over.

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And banned. From the iPhone at work, on lunch.
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all i know is, each time you sig something i say on MCB, i keep getting points towards a ban.
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eeyore
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Joined: Jun 18, 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 09, 2010 8:46 pm    Post subject: Re: Promaster FAQ

63VDub wrote:
Only things I have found are in the original description, it says the Pm is such abd such inches less tall than the Bushmaster. Can we change that to "shorter" and dementedproducts.us is no longer available.

Consider it done. I need to go through and consolidate the upgrade section (there are two actually) and clean it up in general. But I'm very grateful to Dyemonic for letting us have it. If I'm not mistaken, he was a regular around here for a while, but apparently with school and work and everything else, he hasn't had too much time for ICDO anymore. (Doesn't stop Maloneoni)
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63VDub
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 09, 2010 9:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Promaster FAQ

He and demented we regulars, but both drifted off.

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Dyemonic
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 2010 12:53 am    Post subject: Re: Promaster FAQ

63VDub wrote:
He and demented we regulars, but both drifted off.
Yeah, he got out out of paintball completely and i float around. I'm just too busy with other things.

If you guys need anything more from me for the FAQ just let me know and i'll do me best to help you guys out.
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